Dear all,


The problem: only Yahoo members can see the pictures at
http://fr.photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/birdhybrids/lst

I would recommend that pictures be made available publicly through a
personal web site.  If this is not possible, I have opened an accound on
tripod where I could upload some bird hybrids photos.


Regards,


Serge Dumont
Montréal, Québec
dumontse@...

Hello,

I put in the pics of the list 3 pics of a duck presumed hybrid between
Tufted X SCaup. He's on a pond since 5 days in Spay (Sarthe, Western
France).

Any advice on this bird ?

Regards

Jean-François Le Bihan
e-mail : jeanfrancois.lebihan@...
site web : http://jeanfrancois.lebihan.free.fr

> De: Jeff Wilson <OLCOOT1@...>
> Date: 2 février 2004 2:40:22 GMT+01:00
> À: BIRDWG01@...
> Objet: [BIRDWG01] Hybridization in Doves
> Répondre à: OLCOOT1@...
>
> Jan. 31, 2004
> Memphis, TN
>  
>  
> I'm looking for any information on possible hybrid, Eurasian
> Collared-Dove / Mourning Dove. I photographed a dove exhibiting
> details of both species.  Because of the aggressive nature of Eurasian
> Collared-Doves the possibility does not surprise me, even though
> they come from different genus.
>  
> If this bird is not part Mourning Dove, then is part Passenger
> Pigeon;o)
>  
> I'll put together a page of photos on this bird and make it available
> ASAP.
>  
> I'd be interested in any info, photos or thoughts. 
>  
>  
> Good Birding!!!
>
> Jeff R. Wilson
> OL'COOT / TLBA
> Bartlett, TN

take the whole line (not only the link)


-----Message d'origine-----
De : Emmanuel Cappe [mailto:cappe.em@...]
Envoyé : dimanche 1 février 2004 10:44
À : birdhybrids@...
Objet : [BIRDHYBRIDS] Hybrids Reed x Great Reed Warbler


an abstract of an article on :
http://www.springerlink.com/app/home/contribution.asp?wasp=7pab6qgbth6urvcfl
ftx&referrer=parent&backto=issue,3,6;journal,1,2;linkingpublicationresults,i
d:110831,1




To unsubscribe send a blank message to:

birdhybrids-unsubscribe@...


L'utilisation du service Yahoo! Groupes est soumise à l'acceptation des
Conditions d'utilisation et de la Charte sur la vie privée, disponibles
respectivement sur http://fr.docs.yahoo.com/info/utos.html et
http://fr.docs.yahoo.com/info/privacy.html

an abstract of an article on :
http://www.springerlink.com/app/home/contribution.asp?wasp=7pab6qgbth6urvcfl
ftx&referrer=parent&backto=issue,3,6;journal,1,2;linkingpublicationresults,i
d:110831,1

Dear all,


I am looking for collaborators to help build the Bird Hybrids Database.  If you
think you can help you can contact me in private.

Regards,


Serge Dumont
Montréal, Québec
dumontse@...

[Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte seul on été
supprimées]

Hi all:

Eurasian Wigeon and suspected hybrids with American Wigeon are also
fairly frequent here in California.  I have posted some photos of a
suspected hybrid we saw yesterday at:

www.badboybirding.com/EUWIxAMWI_01252004.htm

Another suspected hybrid from a few weeks back can be viewed at:

www.badboybirding.com/EUWIxAMWI_01032004.htm

Both of these birds showed a dull coppery head that was less
intensely red than one would expect for Eurasian Wigeon, while the
flanks appeared to be a mixture of pink and gray. Both also showed
long pale crown stripes, mixtures of pink and gray on the flanks and
brown-tinged scapulars.  The bird at the first url above showed a
weak green sheen extending back from the eye (not so obvious in the
photos), while the second bird has a green stripe running down the
back of the head.

Another interesting bird from the same date and location as the
second bird can be seen here (click on the Eurasian Wigeon link in
the menu on the left and scroll down to the bottom of the page):

http://www.ericwpreston.com/digiscope.html

This one is very similar to the green-striped form of Eurasian
illustrated at Charlie's site
(http://www.wbkenglish.com/hybducks.asp), with a very prominent
green stripe extending back from the eye. On this side of the
Pacific we tend to label these birds as hybrids even though they
lack other obvious signs of hybridization.  As Charlie points out,
such birds are quite frequent in East Asian populations of Eurasian
Wigeon and, if I remember correctly, are even specifically
illustrated in "A Field Guide to the Birds of Korea" by Lee et al.

Cheers

Stephen

Stephen J. Davies
San Francisco, California
sdavies@...
www.badboybirding.com


--- Dans birdhybrids@..., wbkenglish@a... a écrit
> Dear All,
>
> We posted some images of a similar-sounding Eurasian Wigeon from
South Korea
> on our website recently. Such Wigeons are fairly regular in the
region, and I
> would really appreciate being included in any discussion about
these birds.
> The URL is http://www.wbkenglish.com/hybducks.asp
>
> Regards,
>
> Charlie Moores
> www.wbkenglish.com
> wbkenglish@a...
> (44 0)1249 464370
>
> WBKEnglish is an international conservation network based in South
Korea and
> the UK. It was founded in 2002 by Nial and Charlie MOORES, and
leading Korean
> wetland activist KIM SuKyung. As the only English-language network
with
> activists on the ground in Korea, WBKEnglish is uniquely placed to
provide
> up-to-date information on conservation issues within South Korea.
Much of this
> information is posted on our website, which is updated almost
daily.
> http://www.wbkenglish.com
>
> Want to help us protest the catastrophic Saemangeum reclamation?
We've
> organised a "Samboilbae for Saemangeum" at the end of January and
need as many
> participants as possible. We won't let Saemangeum just disappear
quietly...
> For details go to www.wbkenglish.com
>
>
> [Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte
seul on été supprimées]

Dear All,

We posted some images of a similar-sounding Eurasian Wigeon from South Korea
on our website recently. Such Wigeons are fairly regular in the region, and I
would really appreciate being included in any discussion about these birds.
The URL is http://www.wbkenglish.com/hybducks.asp

Regards,

Charlie Moores
www.wbkenglish.com
wbkenglish@...
(44 0)1249 464370

WBKEnglish is an international conservation network based in South Korea and
the UK. It was founded in 2002 by Nial and Charlie MOORES, and leading Korean
wetland activist KIM SuKyung. As the only English-language network with
activists on the ground in Korea, WBKEnglish is uniquely placed to provide
up-to-date information on conservation issues within South Korea. Much of this
information is posted on our website, which is updated almost daily.
http://www.wbkenglish.com

Want to help us protest the catastrophic Saemangeum reclamation? We've
organised a "Samboilbae for Saemangeum" at the end of January and need as many
participants as possible. We won't let Saemangeum just disappear quietly...
For details go to www.wbkenglish.com


[Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte seul on été
supprimées]

Hey all,

	 I'ld like to get some opinions about a bird I saw today. Looks like an
hybrid of Eurasian and American Wigeon (Anas penelope & Anas americana). The
bird (a male) is absolutly similar to the Eurasian wigeon (Anas penelope),
differences are the following points : Yellow stripe of the face is really
paler than the flashy Yellow stripe of Anas penelope, the hybrid's is creamy
clear yellow ; there is a kind a dark green eyebrow from the upper part of
the eye to the neck and then untill the basis of the neck, this green part,
seen from behind, is not as large as the American's one. Are these hybrids
common ? American wigeons are fairly rare in France and Western palearctic.

G.


[Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte seul on été
supprimées]

----- Original Message -----
From: Frank Neijts
To: Serge Dumont
Sent: Sunday, January 25, 2004 6:25 PM
Subject: lesser whitefront hybrid?


Dear Serge,

The photographs with some lines in Dutch and English of the mystery goose
(possible Lesser Whitefront hybrid) are placed on
http://www.homepages.hetnet.nl/%7Evogelskempen/
There is a link on the homepage ("raadselgans - mystery goose", "klik hier").

Thanks a lot!

Regards,

Frank

[Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte seul on été
supprimées]

Dear all,


Frank Neijts from the Netherlands would like some feedback on a possible Anser
erythropus hybrid.

"
Dear Mr. Dumont,

May I ask your opinion about this goose?
It was observed in a large mixed flock of Whitefronts, Tundra Bean Geese and a
few Pinkfeet and Taiga Bean Geese on Sunday Jan. 18th in the Kempen, a part of
the province Noord-Brabant in the The Netherlands. It was first identified as A.
erythropus  (an extremely rare bird in the Kempen!) but later when studying the
photographs I became highly suspicious about its real identity. For a real
erythropus lots of features seemed wrong: i.e. the headshape (too rounded, no
steep forehead), the shape of the 'white front', the thin eye ring, the colour
of the bill, its total impression etc. etc. But for a 'normal' Whitefront counts
the same!
In the meanwhile more and more votes are for a hybrid with erythropus as one of
the parents (but maybe some generations ago?) i.e. by some members of the
Belgian Rarities Comittee (the Belgian border is only a few miles away from the
record spot and some Belgian birders saw the bird). The problem is that I cannot
find good descriptions let alone photographs of a definite hybrid erythropus to
compare with 'our' bird. It seems that such a bird is never photographed in the
Netherlands despite the fact that nowadays some tens of erythropus overwinter in
our country. So when today (by EBNNL) your request came for joining the
Yahoo-group on bird hybrids I regarded this as a godsend!

Thanks for your reaction.

Greetings,

Frank Neijts, Eindhoven (the Netherlands)
frankneijts@...


The pictures can be seen at:


http://birdhybrids0.tripod.com/DSCN2239_copy.jpg
http://birdhybrids0.tripod.com/DSCN2240_copy.jpg
http://birdhybrids0.tripod.com/DSCN2247_copy.jpg
http://birdhybrids0.tripod.com/DSCN2250_copy.jpg
http://birdhybrids0.tripod.com/DSCN2256_copy.jpg
http://birdhybrids0.tripod.com/DSCN2258_copy.jpg
http://birdhybrids0.tripod.com/DSCN2265_copy.jpg
http://birdhybrids0.tripod.com/DSCN2266_copy.jpg
http://birdhybrids0.tripod.com/DSCN2271_copy.jpg
http://birdhybrids0.tripod.com/DSCN2272_copy.jpg
http://birdhybrids0.tripod.com/DSCN2273_copy.jpg

Regards,


Serge Dumont
Montréal, Québec
dumontse@...

[Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte seul on été
supprimées]

Dear all,


the attached files are not yet permitted on the list to avoid problem with
viruses.

The best option is to give an URL link where to see the photo of the
unidentified bird.

If this is not possible, I have opened an account on tripod where we could
host some pictures.


Regards,


Serge Dumont
Montréal, Québec
dumontse@...

P.S. If the members prefer to permit attached files on the list, I could
change the settings to permit attached files.

Photos du Goéland de St-Thomas
Marco Scichilone
NIGADOO / NB / CANADA
ginica@...
rarebird9@...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jean-Sébastien Guénette" <js_guenette@...>
To: <NB-RBA@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2004 6:47 PM
Subject: [NB-RBA] Goéland de st-thomas


Voici les photos prises aujourd'hui à Saint-Thomas-de-Kent. "Unknown1.jpg"
et "Unknown2.jpg" sont des images tirées du vidéo que j'ai pris.


Jean-Sébastien



Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NB-RBA/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  NB-RBA-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
  http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/



[Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte seul on été
supprimées]

Voici les photos.Excusez l'erreur.

Marco Scichilone
NIGADOO / NB / CANADA
ginica@...
rarebird9@...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jean-Sébastien Guénette" <js_guenette@...>
To: <NB-RBA@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Sunday, January 18, 2004 6:47 PM
Subject: [NB-RBA] Goéland de st-thomas


Voici les photos prises aujourd'hui à Saint-Thomas-de-Kent. "Unknown1.jpg"
et "Unknown2.jpg" sont des images tirées du vidéo que j'ai pris.


Jean-Sébastien



Yahoo! Groups Links

To visit your group on the web, go to:
  http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NB-RBA/

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
  NB-RBA-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
  http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/



[Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte seul on été
supprimées]

Voici quelques photos prises par Jean-Sébastien Guénette lors d'une
excursion `a St-Thomas,Nouveau-Brunswick.

De quoi s'agit-il exactement ?

D'un Goéland artic Kumlien?

  (L'oeil est pâle même si ce n'est pas un critère absolue et il semble avoir
un manque de "noir" sous l'aile au bout des primaires.)

Qu'en pensez-vous? Nous avions également pensé `a la possibilité d'un Thayer
mais le plumage est plutût pâle,le bec est assez petit et la tête ne
ressemble pas `a celle d'un Thayer.

Ouvert `a vos suggestions et hypothèses.

Marco Scichilone
NIGADOO / NB / CANADA
ginica@...
rarebird9@...
----- Original Message -----
From: "Serge Dumont" <dumontse@...>
To: <birdhybrids@...>
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 8:01 PM
Subject: [BIRDHYBRIDS] Fw: Netta rufina x Anas platyrhynchos


> Dear all,
>
>
> I am forwarding a message that might interest others.
>
> Regards,
>
>
> Serge Dumont
> Montréal, Québec
> dumontse@...
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Kalle Rainio" <karainio@...>
> To: <dumontse@...>
> Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 4:56 AM
> Subject: Netta rufina x Anas platyrhynchos
>
>
> > Hi,
> > you might be interested in a Red-crested pochard- Mallard hybrid I
> photographed in Germany last March.
> >
> > Have a look at by home page:
> > http://users.utu.fi/karainio/
> > -> photos -> birds
> >
> > With best regards,
> >
> > Kalle Rainio, MSc.
> > University of Turku
> > Department of Biology
> > Section of Ecology
> > FIN-20014 Turku
> > tel:
> > +358 2 333 5813 (work)
> > +358 40 5850547 (mobile)
> > +358 2 333 6550 (fax)
> > e-mail: karainio@...
> >
> >
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe send a blank message to:
>
> birdhybrids-unsubscribe@...
>
>
> L'utilisation du service Yahoo! Groupes est soumise à l'acceptation des
> Conditions d'utilisation et de la Charte sur la vie privée, disponibles
> respectivement sur http://fr.docs.yahoo.com/info/utos.html et
> http://fr.docs.yahoo.com/info/privacy.html
>
>
>
>

Dear all,


So why is there any field guide book on Bird Hybrids?

I would find useful a book with the most common hybrids illustrated and
described.  For each common combination, e.g. Mallard (Anas platyrhynchos) x
American Black Duck (Anas rubripes), Hooded Crow (Corvus (corone) cornix) x
Carrion Crow (Corvus corone), there could be a description of F1, F2 and
backcross hybrids.  Why not a field guide with the 100 most common bird hybrids?

Hybrids are very interesting for the evolution of birds and classification.  But
there are no bird hybrids checklist.  No bird hybrids field guide book.

What do you think?


Serge Dumont
Montréal, Québec
dumontse@...







[Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte seul on été
supprimées]

Dear all,


another private message of interest.  Many authors publish in other
languages than English on bird hybrids that are not listed in Zoological
Record or Biosis.  Here is a list received today from Mr. Jevgeni Shergalin
about Russian litterature on bird hybrids.

I am very grateful for such a contribution that will help built a better
Bird Hybrids Database.

Regards,


Serge Dumont
Montreal, Quebec
dumontse@...

> Dear Dr. Serge Dumont,
>
> I am glad to send you the Russian (mainly) bibliography on bird
> hybridisation which includes a series of new publications on this topic.
It
> is attached and pasted below.
>
> With best regards
> Sincerely Yours,
>
> Jevgeni (Eugene)
>
> Jevgeni Shergalin,
> Sopruse pst. 175-58
> Tallinn 13413 Estonia.
> Tel: (3725) 090684
> Fax: (3726) 599351
> E-mail: zoolit@...
> http://my.tele2.ee/birds/
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/BirdsinRussia/


RUSSIAN (mainly) BIBLIOGRAPHY ON AVIAN HYBRIDIZATION



Balatskiy, N.N. 1992. Sluchai blizkorodstvennoj gibridizatsii u ovsyanok,
vyurkov, tryasoguzok v lesostepi Zapadnoj Sibiri [Cases of closely relative
hybridisation of buntings, Finches and Wagtails in the forest-steppe of the
Western Siberia]. // Sovremennaya ornitologiya 1991 [Modern Ornithology
1991]. Moscow, Nauka. 273-275.



*Bergmanis, U., Petrins, A., Strazds, M., Krams, I. 1996. Possible case of
hybridization of the Lesser Spotted Eagle in Eastern Latvia. // Putni daba,
6.3. P.2-6.



*Bergmanis, U., Strazds, M. 2001. Another possible hybridisation case of
Lesser and Greater Spotted Eagle in Latvia. // Putni daba, 11.2. P.6-7.



Belousov, E.M. 1998. O gibridizatsii chernogolovoi (Emberiza melanocephala
Scopoli, 1769) I zhelchnoi (E.bruniceps Bramdt, 1841) ovsyanok v nizov’yakh
r.Atrek (yugo-vostochnyi Prikaspiy) [About hybridisation of Emberiza
melanocephala and E.bruniceps in low Atrek river]. // Selevinia 1996-1997.
241.



Dement’yev, G.P. 1939. K voprosu o pomesyakh plastinchatoklyuvykh ptits v
estestvennykh usloviyakh [On question about Anseriformes hybrids in natural
conditions]. // Byull. MOIP [Bull. of Moscow Naturalist’s Soc.]. Otd. biol.
[Dept. biol.]. Vol.48. issue 1. P.81-85.



*Dombrowski, V.Ch. 2002. Gibridizatsiya malogo (Aquila pomarina) i bol’shogo
(A.clanga) podorlikov v Belarusi: pravilo ili isklyuchenie ? [Hybridization
of Lesser and Greater Spotted Eagles (Aquila pomarina et A.clanga) in
Belarus: Rule or Exception ?] // Subbuteo. Vol.5. N1. Pp.23-31. In Russian
with English summaries.



Friedman, V.S. 1995. O gibridizatsii bol’shogo pestrogo i sirijskogo dyatlov
v Ukraine: est’ li otbor protiv gibridov ? [On hybridisation of Great
Spotted Woodpecker and Syrian Woodpecker in Ukraine: is there any selection
against hybrids ?] // Problemy vyvchennya ta okhorony ptakhiv. Materialy VI
narady ornitologiv Zakhidnoi Ukrainy (Drogobych, 1-3 February 1995)
[Problems of study and protection of birds. Materials of the VI conference
of Western Ukraine Ornithologists]. Lviv-Chernivtsi. P. 133-135.



Koblik, E.A., Tsvetkov, A.V. 1998. Nablyudenie gibridnoi poganki v Podmoskov
’ye [Observation of the hybrid Grebe in Moscow Region]. // Ornitologiya
[Ornithology]. Moscow, Moscow State Univ. Press. Vol.28. Pp.242-243.



Koshelev, A.I., Lobkov, V.A. 1998. O nasledovanii roditel’skikh priznakov v
operenii gibrida kryakvy i sviyazi (Anas platyrhynchos x Anas penelope) [On
heritability of parental features in the plumage of Mallard x European
Wigeon hybrid]. // Sovremennaya ornitologiya 1998 [Modern Ornithology 1998].
Moscow, Nauka. 322-332.   Fig.5. Bibl.8 titl.



*Lohmus, A., Vali, U. 2001. Interbreeding of the Greater Aquila clanga and
Lesser Spotted Eagles Aquila pomarina. // Acta ornithoecol. 4.2-4. Jena.
P.377-384.



Panchenko, V.G. 1977. Gibrid kryakvy i chirka-svistunka [Hybrid between
Mallard and Teal]. // Ornitologiya [Ornithology]. Issue 13. P.208-209.



*Panov, E.N. 1989. Gibridizatsiya i etologicheskaya isolyatsiya u ptits
[Hybridization and ethological isolation in birds]. M., Nauka. 512 p.



Pavlyuk, R.S. 1986. O sparivanii domovogo vorob’ya s zyablikom v nevole i
kladke gibridnykh yaits [On copulation of the House Sparrow with Chafffinch
in captivity and clutch of hybrid eggs]. // Aktual’nye problemy ornitologii
[Actual problems of ornithology]. Moscow, Nauka. 234-235.



Serebrovskiy, A.S. 1935. Gibridizatsiya zhivotnykh [Hybridization of
animals]. M.; L. Biomedgiz. 290 p.



Shutova, E.V. 1986. O sluchae gibiridizatsii pukhlyaka i serogolovoj gaichki
v estestvennykh usloviyakh [On hybridisation case between Willow Tit and
Siberian Tit in natural conditions]. // Aktual’nye problemy ornitologii
[Actual problems of ornithology]. Moscow, Nauka. 233-234.



Vali, J.I., Lohmus, A.A. 2001. Kharakteristika gibridov bol’shogo i malogo
podorlika (Aquila clanga x pomarina) [Characteristics of hybrids of the
Greater Spotted and Lesser Spotted Eagles (Aquila clanga x pomarina)]. //
Aktual’nye problemy izucheniya i okhrany ptits Vostochnoi Evropy i Severnoi
Azii [Actual problems of study and protection of birds of East Europe and
North Asia]. Materials of Int. Conf. Republic of Tatarstan, 29 January – 3
February 2001. Pp.154-155.



Yalygin, P.I. 1998. O gibriridizatsii belokrylogo klesta s kanareikoj
[Hybridization of White-winged crossbill and domesticated Island canary in
captivity]. // Sovremennaya ornitologiya 1998 [Modern Ornithology 1998].
Moscow, Nauka. 332-337. 2 photo.



*Yurko, V.V. 2002. Gibrid shilokhovsti (Anas acuta) i kryakvy
(A.platyrhynchos) [Hybrid of Pintail (Anas acuta) and Mallard
(A.platyrhynchos)]. // Subbuteo. Vol.5., Nr.1. P.45. In Russian with English
summary.



Compiled and translated by Jevgeni Shergalin, Sopruse pst. 175-58, Tallinn
13413 Estonia. Tel: (3725) 090684; Fax: (3726) 599351; E-mail:
zoolit@...


[Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte seul on été
supprimées]

Dear all,


I am forwarding a message that might interest others.

Regards,


Serge Dumont
Montréal, Québec
dumontse@...

----- Original Message -----
From: "Kalle Rainio" <karainio@...>
To: <dumontse@...>
Sent: Friday, January 23, 2004 4:56 AM
Subject: Netta rufina x Anas platyrhynchos


> Hi,
> you might be interested in a Red-crested pochard- Mallard hybrid I
photographed in Germany last March.
>
> Have a look at by home page:
> http://users.utu.fi/karainio/
> -> photos -> birds
>
> With best regards,
>
> Kalle Rainio, MSc.
> University of Turku
> Department of Biology
> Section of Ecology
> FIN-20014 Turku
> tel:
> +358 2 333 5813 (work)
> +358 40 5850547 (mobile)
> +358 2 333 6550 (fax)
> e-mail: karainio@...
>
>

Pardon, mais je ne parle pas français assez bon!
Sometimes in assessing vagrant records, the question of hybrids comes up. I=
f
a bird looks as though it might have hybrid origins, but its size is outsid=
e the
range of the candidate parents, is this good enough to eliminate the
possibility of a hybrid? In other words, could a hybrid appear like a runt =
or a
giant?
Dick Newell, Cambridge, UK

Hi to all and specifically to Dave Moore,


your unidentified duck pictures,
http://fr.photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/birdhybrids/lst, look a lot like the
Egyptian Goose (Alopochen aegyptiacus) but I agree with you when you say:

"However, from the books illustrations the eye patch is almond shaped on both
adults and juveniles on the Egyptian goose and round and indistinct on my
goose.  There is no dark ring at the base of the bill and the leg and bill
colour seems wrong. As well the neck ring appears to be less well formed."

Moreover the white forewing is not showing on these pictures.  Is it present on
other pictures that you have?

The photo could fit a juvenile Egyptian Goose as described by Madge S. and Burn
H. "Waterfowl"

"Whole plumage duller than adult and lacking chocolate-brown face and breast
patches and collar; crown and hind-neck dusky-brown.  White of upperwing-coverts
sullied with greyish-brown, secondaries duller.  Becomes much as adult during
first winter, but juvenile wing retained until first-summer moult"

Maybe it is a juvenile plumage prior to the first-summer moult.  I am not an
expert of the Egyptian Goose though.

If it is an hybrid, the Egyptian Goose, Alopochen aegyptiacus, is known to
hybridise with the following species:

Egyptian Goose (Alopochen aegyptiacus) X

     Mallard (Anas platyrhynchos) which would include the domestic duck
     Greater White-fronted Goose (Anser albifrons)
     Greylag Goose (Anser anser)
     Snow Goose (Anser caerulescens)
     Swan Goose (Anser cygnoïdes)
     Canada Goose (Branta canadensis)
     Muscovy Duck (Cairina moschata)
     Australian Wood Duck (Chenonetta jubata)
     Andean Goose (Chloephaga melanoptera)
     Magellan Goose (Chloephaga picta)
     Blue-winged Goose (Cyanochen cyanopterus)
     Orinoco Goose (Neochen jubata)
     Spur-winged Goose (Plectropterus gambensis)
     South African Shelduck (Tadorna cana)
     Ruddy Shelduck (Tadorna ferruginea)
     Common Shelduck (Tadorna tadorna)

All of these hybrids have been observed in captivity except the Alopochen
aegyptiacus x Tadorna tadorna that has been observed in the wild.  References
can be found on the Bird Hybrids Database web site for each hybrid.

Any other ideas?



Serge Dumont
Montréal, Québec
dumontse@...

[Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte seul on été
supprimées]

First I must apologize for my original assessment as an Orinoco goose,
Neochen jubata.  I was looking in the book "Waterfowl: An identification
guide to the ducks, geese and Swans of the World" by Madge and Burn, Pub.
Houghton Mifflin Co.
Plate 13 on pages 50-51 show three species of crested shelducks and
sheldgeese, numbers 42, 46 and 47.  The text on the left page is in
numerical order from top to bottom [42,46,47]
The illustrations on the right page are not in the same order [42, 47 and
46]
I naturally assumed the images of the Egyptian goose went with the text of
the Orinoco goose as they were opposite each other.

If you have/use this book beware!  Many of the pages are laid out like this.

However, from the books illustrations the eye patch is almond shaped on both
adults and juveniles on the Egyptian goose and round and indistinct on my
goose.  There is no dark ring at the base of the bill and the leg and bill
colour seems wrong. As well the neck ring appears to be less well formed.

I agree that an Egyptian goose is probably one parent, but what else could
be mixed in there?  I would think that perhaps a common barnyard goose?

Cheers
Dave Moore
Ottawa, ON, Canada

----- Original Message -----
From: Alain Fossé
To: birdhybrids@...

> the two pictures are now available at:
>
> http://fr.photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/birdhybrids/lst
>
> Please send your comments to Dave Moore, mooredw@..., as well.

I have no book with me but why it's not a pure Egyptian Goose Alopochen
aegyptiaca?

Cheers.
Alain Fossé, LPO Anjou, Maine-et-Loire, France
alfosse@...
http://www.digimages.info/
http://membres.lycos.fr/listoiseauxmonde/
http://www.lpo-anjou.org/

> Message du 22/01/04 13:53
> De : Serge Dumont
> A : birdhybrids@...
> Objet : Re: Re: [BIRDHYBRIDS] upload your files & pictures

> the two pictures are now available at:
>
> http://fr.photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/birdhybrids/lst
>
> Please send your comments to Dave Moore, mooredw@..., as well.

I have no book with me but why it's not a pure Egyptian Goose Alopochen
aegyptiaca?

Cheers.
Alain Fossé, LPO Anjou, Maine-et-Loire, France
alfosse@...
http://www.digimages.info/
http://membres.lycos.fr/listoiseauxmonde/
http://www.lpo-anjou.org/

Hi,

Good idea to create this mailing list !

I think the goose is a Egyptian Goose / Alopochen aegyptiacus.

It may be a young one. Is this bird very common in birdparks in
North America ?

Cheers

JF

Jean-François LE BIHAN
e-mail : jeanfrancois.lebihan@...
site web : http://jeanfrancois.lebihan.free.fr

Dear all,


the two pictures are now available at:

http://fr.photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/birdhybrids/lst

Please send your comments to Dave Moore, mooredw@..., as well.

Regards,


Serge Dumont
Montréal, Québec
dumontse@...

> Message du 22/01/04 05:29
> De : Serge Dumont
> A : birdhybrids@...
> Objet : Re: [BIRDHYBRIDS] Fw: Hybrid? Goose?

> the attached pictures are not permitted on the list. In order to see them,
> we will have to display them on another website or to contact Dave Moore
> directly, mooredw@..., to get the pictures.

Or upload the files in the files section of the [birdhybrids] web site
<http://fr.groups.yahoo.com/group/birdhybrids/files/> or the pictures in the
photo section <http://fr.photos.groups.yahoo.com/group/birdhybrids/lst>

Cheers.
Alain Fossé, LPO Anjou, Maine-et-Loire, France
alfosse@...
http://www.digimages.info/
http://membres.lycos.fr/listoiseauxmonde/
http://www.lpo-anjou.org/

Hi again,


the attached pictures are not permitted on the list.  In order to see them,
we will have to display them on another website or to contact Dave Moore
directly, mooredw@..., to get the pictures.


Regards,


Serge Dumont
Montréal, Québec
dumontse@...

Dear all,


I have just received the following message in private:

From: Dave Moore
To: dumontse@...
Sent: Wednesday, January 21, 2004 1:47 PM
Subject: Hybrid? Goose?


Hello Serge

A few years ago a strange goose? duck? showed up at a friends cottage just north
of Hull, PQ.  He says it was very friendly so it's probably an escapee, but of
what parentage??

The closest I've found is an Orinocco Goose, Neochen jubata.

Any thoughts?

Cheers
Dave Moore
Ottawa, ON, Canada


----- Original Message -----

Any ideas?


Thanks,



Serge Dumont
Montréal, Québec
dumontse@...

[Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte seul on été
supprimées]

Dear all,


on the ornitho-qc mailing list there is a discussion about a probable

Gyr Falcon (Falco rusticolus) X Saker Falcon (Falco cherrug) hybrid.  The
discussions are still open on the identification of this bird.

Pictures can be seen at:

http://www3.sympatico.ca/jeaniron/

Click on Mystery Falcon to see the pictures.


Regards,


Serge Dumont
Montréal, Québec
dumontse@...



[Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte seul on été
supprimées]

Le 21 janv. 2004, à 17:35, Serge Dumont a écrit :

> this is a test, ceci est un test.

And that works, et ça marche ! ;-)

Amitiés.

PS : aucun fichier attaché, détruisez s'il y en a.
================================================
Alain Fossé, LPO Anjou, Montreuil-Juigné, France
47° 31' 34" N, 0° 35' 43" W <alfosse chez wanadoo.fr>
Ma digiscopie <http://www.digimages.info/>
Ma liste française des oiseaux du Monde
<http://membres.lycos.fr/listoiseauxmonde/>
Site LPO Anjou <http://www.lpo-anjou.org/>
================================================

Bonjour, Hi,


this is a test, ceci est un test.


Serge Dumont
Montréal, Québec
dumontse@...

[Les parties de ce message comportant autre chose que du texte seul on été
supprimées]